dogdude

Tip number 1) Ideally, I like to train a new trialling dog on a new and different ground each night for about a month, so he gets comfortable working in strange surroundings. In the week leading up to the trial, work on your weakest exercise all week, but keep the routine the same regarding length of time etc. Keep it short and sweet. Do not get frustrated and use a harsh correction (if you use them at all). 2) Get to the trial early for vetting etc and to give your dog time to settle his nerves in the new surroundings, take him for a short walk. If you normally use food drive, make sure he is hungry, but pump him up with a really short warm up just before trial starts. Find out what order you will enter the ring to guage your time for warm up. Make sure warm up is well away from trial ring. 3) Remember that when you are asked to enter the ring to start, you are immediately being judged, even as you make your way to the start post. In mock trials, you should have already worked out which side of the post to stand on, so as not to supprise the dog. I prefer LHS so that I am standing between the post because the dogs tend to want to sniff them. You dont want to be pulling at your dog at the start post. Judge will ask you "are you ready"? Make sure your dog is paying attention to you before you anwer "yes" 4) Listen to what the judge is saying carefully, but remain relaxed. She will tell you what to do, you will then give the hand signals (nice and clear, but do not let them linger) and commands. You can only get your dogs attention by name at the start of each exercise. eg: "Rover,... heel", but not after that point in each exercise. Remember to leave a distinctive pause between dogs name and recall command if you use his name, and always remember to leave the ring via the gate, and never just step over the ropes to get out when your finished. During group stays, dont forget to organise yourself into a line in sequence to that which you went through the ring in with the other competitors before you all enter the ring. When you leave your dog for the stays, make sure you leave in perfect sequence to everyone else or you will lose points. The same goes for when you all return. Probably think of more later. Oh yeh, make sure dog is well toileted before entering ring. Fouling ring is a points deduction.

That should be for office use I think. Your dogs rego will go AR1234. AR obviously stands for Associate Register

Yes, train in the rain. I never wear long coats while training or trialling as my dog loses his focus point and becomes confused. His heeling becomes inconsistant. Although I do train in the rain, I cant say my dog enjoys it. They either do or they don't and I for one cant seem to get him to ignore it. Last trialling dog was bomb proof in the rain, and I always felt that it was a big advantage to us if it was a wet trial.

Yayyy BC & Cooper!! Congratulations!

Come on Jules! I live in Epping remember!! No excuses They are great run throughs because they have the same level of distractions as a real trial. Good experience for new trialling dog or novice handler.

I am not up with gun dog training, so I really do not know why they use FR. Probably the same reason as I use it. Its quicker. There has been books written by top trainers that do suggest that FR does produce more reliable retreives, but no studys that I know of. I speak from experience training different breeds. Every one has there own line of thinking though. I respect that. Hi Arya Yes, looking forward to FOO nights, and I hope some of the other DOLers can make it this year. Anyone else planning to come? Leo, JulesP, Jesomil, RoxysMum, Shoemonster? They do mock trials with real judges, and have a BBQ as well.

Hmm, I find it quite funny that the people that are so against the FR have 1)never used it, and 2) own retreiving breeds. I would like to see you train a British Bulldog with the same methods. Helen, why does FR put a dog off having anything in its mouth? Never had a problem. I am yet to attend a club in Melbourne that actually teaches step by step how to do any type of retreive. They often tell you how to force a dog to hold it, then you are expected to go away to fill in the blanks. I bet I could go back to my old club on Sunday and find the same people that still have a dog that will not retreive. I am happy to use whatever method suits the dog, but FR is my first choice. The forced part of it is used in all for about a week. I then use food drive as motivation. The dog does not require further use of the ear pinch. Like any type of aversive training, the method is only as harsh as the trainer.

As most people know, I teach FR. There is a few comments suggesting that this method produces a dog that is doing something that it "has to", and dosn't enjoy it in the slightest. That will all depend on how you structure the rest of your training. Those who have seen my dog retreive will tell you that it is probably his favourite exercise. Whatever method that you use, you should not use the "game of dumbell" as the driving force behind a retreive. Otherwise, you won't have a "retreive", just a game of fetch. I am not saying that you cant play with it outside formal training, but I don't. During a trial, the dog "has to" retreive. Personally, I wouldn't spend a couple of hundred bucks on a trialling weekend only for my dog to "not be feeling very playfull". These trainers are nearly always shown up under moderate to high distraction. I have trained one dog using the marker method, but I found it just took far too long compared to FR to get it at a reliable stage. Even then, I still was never 100% confident. Oscar took one week to have a moderately proofed retreive, another week till I would be confident enough to of had it at basic trial standard, one more week till his retreive matched the mental picture I was after (speed and accuracy, lack of mouthing etc) Oscar is quite soft, so he was very easy to teach. Many people think that a hard dog is more suited to FR, but I find the opposite. When I tried it on my BT, he just looked at me and smiled (was using considerable force) went on to train him with marker method instead. My crossbred on the other hand, I only needed to suggest gently touching his ear, and he complied instantly. Oscar was the same. Using the ear pinch method is IMO less uncomfortable for a dog than a rip on a checkchain. It is done on the cartlidge part, and no "pulling" whatsoever is involved. I have heard barbaric stories of pliers etc but never seen it. Some trainers have been known to use a "hang dog" method with checkchain as well, but I think a dog that required that wouldn't be much fun to train, and I definately would not go to that extreme. So, in summary, I mainly use FR because it gets really fast results, but if the method does not suit the dog, I will use marker or clicker.

Hi BMP Sit has no hand signal, stand usually left palm waved in front of dog horizontally, (I use right), drop right palm facing dog in downward chopping motion (no closer than about 30cm in front of dogs snout. When using signals at distance, (like recall) use one that changes your whole body's silhouette, so the dog can clearly see it. ie hands and arms outside of your bodyline.

Waringal used to be a branch of Northern Obedience Dog Club (Moonee Ponds). I went there for a look, but chose Northern. There is also another large club that trains around the corner from Waringal at Bundoora Park. Can't remember the name (starts with "W"). It is not VCA affiliated, but it is a large club. Unfortunately, the classes are a little large, but the organisers were nice people. Very welcoming considering I was from another club having a sticky beak. They even let me join into class for the day. That club is not trial focussed, but it does have some instructors with trialling backgrounds. Cant remember which morning they train though? either Sat or Sun morning.

Pehaps I am reading into something that is not there in the original post? My understanding is that 4Paws wants to build toy(prey) drive in her dog. Teaching retrieve and "drive" are two different things. I guess the outcome will be determined if 4Paws wants to use it to train exercises, or just wants them to chase a ball. To me, this is not clear? Perhaps I am having a moment?

Hi Tony I do not think prey drive and food drive have anything in common, other than drive. My own dog proves that to me. I do not chop and change the drive satisfaction for my dog. I am happy to agree to disagree though

Congrats! Its great when you see the first penny dropping. I find they also go through another transformation when they mature, between 2-3 years old. Especially if you plan to trial them. Its like all of a sudden they wake up different dogs.

Hi Pinniacle dts From what little I know about drive training, its not good to switch from using one drive to another in the same exercise, or at all? If you use a food reward to teach the dog to go after the ball, wouldn't it be food drive that it is working for?Kind of teaching retrieve? Obviously you would drop the food reward, but would it have helped to build up prey/toy drive? I'm not so sure. I am not an expert in prey drive training though. Just what I have picked up here. I use food drive to train my dog, but he will not chase a ball unless I ask him to retrieve it.

If it was me, I would use the orbee, because building drive using tug element as well will enhance the dogs excitement, while you are teasing him with it. If you plan to use the drive to train them, then definately the orbee. I would not include food rewards if its prey drive that you want.

To make a comparison, $1000 would be enough money to educate 3 dogs with memberships that last as long as the dogs life at our club.

Dog obedience clubs usually have an array of sizes, but I find it ideal to get one custom made, using your dogs measurements (muzzle width, practical size overall, thickness of shaft). Most stair case factorys have wood turners in them that you could con. Inside of dumbell ends should have a slight outward taper for good vision while in the mouth. You can buy ready made one's on the net, but I find the size is never right.

Using either or both properly will give you a similar result. A check chain will not teach a dog anything if it is not jerked on when needed, but i'm sure you will work that out in the coming weeks. A check needs to be as hard as necessary to gain your dogs attention, otherwise you are wasting your time.This will be light on some dogs, and heavier on others. Either method used the wrong way can give you undesirable results. If you learn both methods, you will end up a better trainer for it, as going to extremes in either will usually give you problems.

Training with a dumbell from the start will help the dog. I have never heard of it ruinning a dog! What is the persons theory behind that one? IMO it is important to use a correctly fitting dumbell right from the start. The ground clearance for the lower jaw being most important in helping the dog pick it up during the learning stages. A correct length of shaft will keep it confidently snug in the dogs mouth, which helps to discourage mouthing and throwing it around in his/her mouth. Encourage dog to hold it just behind canine teeth.

Nice post MrsD

Hi Raps Asking newbys about trialling just gets you confused looks most of the time, and even the advanced class members are usually hard to convince having a go. I would say that maybe 1-3% of club members have a go at trialling each year, maybe less. I do agree though that the club as a whole remembers that it is "a club", with people there just for the social side of it. As an instructor though, it can get frustrating wasting your (and other keen members time) by having them in your class. As someone has already mentioned, the instructors reward is seeing a member progress and later seeing "their methods" instilled in "the beleivers". At the end of the day, they do have other things they can be doing that reward themselves. There is also competition among instructors to an extent. It is always nice to see your class advancing, and glowing approval from your students. That is what I beleive is the reason most volunteer instructors give up their time. They too need reward. If they don't get it, they can get a little cranky just like the best of us.

Hi TNT I would say that if your hands are red raw after class, and the dog has scabbing on its neck from the use of a check chain,............. then something is most definately not working in your training method. Obedience clubs do not focus on trialling, their bread and butter membership lies with pet owners. There could be any number of reasons that you are in the position that you are in now, perhaps wrong method for your dog, bad instruction or handler error, etc etc.

Good teachers are hard to find in any field, and dog school is no different. Some people think that "taking charge" is teaching etc etc. The truth is that really skillfull dog guru's are very thin on the ground. Skillfull dog guru's that are good teachers are even harder to find. We do live in the communication age now, so thankfully plenty of info is freely accessable via internet, reading and seminars. As members of dog obedience clubs who pay next to no fee's, you cant really expect to recieve guru quality advice, delivered to you by an expert people person. As an instructor in years gone by, I can tell you that most people do not do the work, and the few that do are normally the ones to progress quickly. I have seen some dogs attending for 5 years in some cases, because the owners think that one Sunday a week or fortnight is enough training, so it is usually the first line of thought when an instructor is trying to work out why a dog is not progressing. The best instructors do more talking (and listening) than drilling exercises during class. If you find one of these, use them! If you don't have one of these people at your club, remember that there are more benefits to an obedience club membership than just knowledge. If it is dog sports or instructing that you want to do, then you are going to have to look everywhere else to expand your expertise anyway.

Miss Squishy Face started a thread on the same topic and its currently on page 4

Hi Fairfield in Melbourne, or Sydney? Closest VCA club in Melbourne would be Northcote.