BJean

Thanks Steve, What the ANKC should be doing is fighting back and stop giving into them and start counteracting their uneducated opinions. this is exactly what the letter is asking the CCs to do. Steve and Mita thankyou for your deconstruction analyses of the RSPCA publication pending what the CCs reply with, I intend to use some of your content, if that is okay

to all the responses hopefully we can get some letters out,

Oh! Wow. I think science just died a little. yep sad but true

Could those interested PM me their email address please. Thankyou

Forgot to add that I can only send the letter to those who are members of their State Canine Council. Thankyou L

No organisation can publish unfounded claims about another and expect it to go unanswered, similarly a represenative body cannot allow misinformation brandishing its members and their practises, to remain unchallenged. The CCs can dispute what the RSPCA is saying because there is no evidence to back up RSPCA claims, notwithstanding that the logic of the RSPCA's creative writing special is not based on fact but biased conjecture. Natsu I have sent you a PM

Can those interested PM me their email address please ta

I have a template for a short letter to the Canine Councils regarding the RSPCA's campaign against pedigree dogs. For those that care enough to do something and want to write to their Canine Council to voice their concern but don't know how to, won't or can't send me a PM and I will send you the template - all you have to do is add in your name and the name of your State Canine Council, and then email it to your state CC. The letter is in reference to the RSPCA FAQ on Pedigree Dogs in Australia http://www.rspcavic.org/campaigns_news/ima...d_Questions.pdf cheers L:) What is the RSPCA asking for? There needs to be a fundamental shift in the way purebred dogs are selected and bred in Australia. The RSPCA would like to see breeders put health, welfare and functionality ahead of the appearance of pedigree dogs. This will involve acknowledging the health and welfare problems in each breed and reviewing and revising breed standards. We’d like the ANKC to prohibit the registration of 1st and 2nd degree matings; to open studbooks; and outcross then backcross where necessary to increase the genetic diversity within particular breeds. Are cross-bred dogs healthier than purebred dogs? The science tells us that dogs that are the result of matings between unrelated animals have a fitness advantage due to their genetic diversity, they are more resistant to both infectious and genetic disease. Perhaps the best indicator that mixed breeds are generally healthier is that it’s more expensive to purchase pet insurance for a purebred dog, because the average vet bills for pedigree breeds are much higher than for crossbreeds. Isn't pedigree breeding really about bettering the breed? Unfortunately in many cases ‘bettering’ the breed simply means producing animals that increasingly fit the breed standard description. Many breed standards are not fit for purpose and have led to the exaggeration of physical features that compromise welfare and health. ‘Bettering’ should mean breeding for happy, healthy, fit dogs that are suited to their environment – after all the vast majority of dogs become family pets. If one is truly committed to ‘bettering’ a breed we would be increasingly breeding dogs that can breathe easier, walk without pain or discomfort and once again give birth naturally. What is the dog show circuit like in Australia? The dog show circuit is active in Australia and is taken very seriously by the pedigree dog breeders who frequent them. The dog show circuit uses the written breed standard as the basis in determining ‘winners’ just as they do in the UK. The RSPCA would like to see a fundamental change in the attitudes of show judges, with much less emphasis placed on physical traits. Is inbreeding a problem in Australia? The Australian National Kennel Council (ANKC) does not prohibit the mating of first degree (brothersister, mother-son) or second degree mating (grandfather-granddaughter). Some pedigree dog breeders deliberately mate close relatives, which increases the chances of inherited disorders in puppies and makes puppies less resistant to both infectious and genetic disease. Closed stud books, where only animals registered with the ANKC can breed, also decrease the gene pool. A lack of genetic variation increases the chances of inherited disorders, compromises the immune system and may lead to infertility.

I have a template for a short letter to the Canine Councils regarding the RSPCA's campaign against pedigree dogs. For those that care enough to do something and want to write to their Canine Council to voice their concern but don't know how to, won't or can't send me a PM and I will send you the template - all you have to do is add in your name and the name of your State Canine Council, and then email it to your state CC. The letter is in reference to the RSPCA FAQ on Pedigree Dogs in Australia http://www.rspcavic.org/campaigns_news/ima...y_Asked_Questio ns.pdf cheers L:) What is the RSPCA asking for? There needs to be a fundamental shift in the way purebred dogs are selected and bred in Australia. The RSPCA would like to see breeders put health, welfare and functionality ahead of the appearance of pedigree dogs. This will involve acknowledging the health and welfare problems in each breed and reviewing and revising breed standards. We’d like the ANKC to prohibit the registration of 1st and 2nd degree matings; to open studbooks; and outcross then backcross where necessary to increase the genetic diversity within particular breeds. Are cross-bred dogs healthier than purebred dogs? The science tells us that dogs that are the result of matings between unrelated animals have a fitness advantage due to their genetic diversity, they are more resistant to both infectious and genetic disease. Perhaps the best indicator that mixed breeds are generally healthier is that it’s more expensive to purchase pet insurance for a purebred dog, because the average vet bills for pedigree breeds are much higher than for crossbreeds. Isn't pedigree breeding really about bettering the breed? Unfortunately in many cases ‘bettering’ the breed simply means producing animals that increasingly fit the breed standard description. Many breed standards are not fit for purpose and have led to the exaggeration of physical features that compromise welfare and health. ‘Bettering’ should mean breeding for happy, healthy, fit dogs that are suited to their environment – after all the vast majority of dogs become family pets. If one is truly committed to ‘bettering’ a breed we would be increasingly breeding dogs that can breathe easier, walk without pain or discomfort and once again give birth naturally. What is the dog show circuit like in Australia? The dog show circuit is active in Australia and is taken very seriously by the pedigree dog breeders who frequent them. The dog show circuit uses the written breed standard as the basis in determining ‘winners’ just as they do in the UK. The RSPCA would like to see a fundamental change in the attitudes of show judges, with much less emphasis placed on physical traits. Is inbreeding a problem in Australia? The Australian National Kennel Council (ANKC) does not prohibit the mating of first degree (brothersister, mother-son) or second degree mating (grandfather-granddaughter). Some pedigree dog breeders deliberately mate close relatives, which increases the chances of inherited disorders in puppies and makes puppies less resistant to both infectious and genetic disease. Closed stud books, where only animals registered with the ANKC can breed, also decrease the gene pool. A lack of genetic variation increases the chances of inherited disorders, compromises the immune system and may lead to infertility. http://www.rspcavic.org/campaigns_news/ima...y_Asked_Questio ns.pdf

I have a template for a short letter to the Canine Councils reagrding the RSPCA's campaign against pedigree dogs. For those that want to write to their CC but don't won't or can't send me a PM and I will send you the template - all you have to do is add in your name and the name of your State Canine Council. The letter is in reference to the RSPCA FAQ on Pedigree Dogs in Australia. cheers L:)

maybe because dogs probably have lifetime immunity after their first series of vaccinations?

Thanks BB @ 6.5 weeks all looks good Dont think I can get to Cohuna though... can't find an Anatolian nurse / dog sitter

If a dog attacks from a sense of territory and self-defence (as what sounds the case here) its behaviour to a perceived unknown in its own environment has NO correlation to how the same dog then behaves at the vet. There is nothing inconsistent in this dog's behaviour. Dogs aren't 'savage' by nature. They dont go out to kill people. The alarm going off, the victim climbing the fence waving the wheel lock, imo explains the outcome.

Some breeders (like myself) prefer it that way - its called privacy If you want to know personal details you can always email/phone the breeder and ask

breeding / importing / health testing /maintaining the breed IS contributing to helping their breed; how many breed enquiries would a breeder receive each week, advising people if the breed is for them etc that is helping the breed. Good breeders are contribting to their breed by doing what they do.

I dont understand your OP

If they believe the dog is a cross bred then how do they go from breed component, to inbreeding being a causal factor of the dog's issues? As dumb as their logic is - this dog has some bulldog in its breeding so its problems must come from bulldog inbreeding - it is PB bashing albeit dumb PB bashing.

sorry not much else to contribute except when looking at websites for puppies / potential sire etc I dont think much of show stacked photos - boring and dont show you much I prefer free standing photos of the dogs, dogs at hme or at work, and photos showing the features that are important to the breed. ie some breeds are a head breed, gait breed etc so I like to see photos of the dogs that depict the breed emphasis.

Imagine the converse if Dogs Vic or the ANKC website, cited that most RSPCA dogs had behavioural issues and the reason why so many were pts, is NOT because there are not enough homes for them, but because the RSPCA deem these dogs NOT rehomeable due to health or temperament defects. Really though anyone who is concerned by the RSPCA campaign against pedigree dogs should stop reading this thread and just hammer out an email to their CC highlighting your concerns, asking them for a response and what they intend to do about it. If my breed was listed on that RSPCA F&Q shiite piece, I'd be storming down the highway to the DogsVic office in person ... as it is, I was moved enough before to write to my CC about the RSPCA anti-pedigree campaign - If this issue matters to you, then do the same thankyou

Our CCs need to know this is happening and that it matters to their members.. ANKC members should write to their state CC's and ask them for a response to the RSCPA's campaigns and 'public information' announcements, which denigrate and/or provide misinforamtion about pedigree dogs. I wrote to Dogs VIc - originally it was to be for the AGM - but they said it was to much to go through in one night so it is now a formal document for the Management Committee to go through and provde a response to by the end of March. I've asked Dogs Victoria for their resposne to the RSPCA's campaign against pedigree dogs. . . Despite Dogs Victoria's public profile and dialogue with the RSPCA, it is apparent that there is a gulf of understanding between the RSPCA's perception of Dogs Victoria breeder members, and indeed the quintessence of the pedigree dog world. We are increasingly being told what to breed, how to breed, how to train, by an organisational body that see pedigree dogs and their breeders as part of the animal welfare 'problem'. Justifiably in response to the RSPCA public statements and legislative direction, an increasing number of Dogs Victoria members no longer view the RSPCA as friend to all animal lovers, but rather as foe and threat to the existence of pedigree dogs and their breeders - why is a charity able to mandate on laws which affect the organisation and member constituents of which the RSPCA have nothing to do with? Where is Dogs Victoria’s public voice and defence of its Members and breeding practices against attacks by the RSPCA and attempts to wrest control of dog breeding away from dog breeders and their representative body? It is up to Dogs Victoria - as the representative body of registered pedigree breeders - to not only consider the implications of RSCPA Victoria's Policies and Priorities, but to actively defend its Members and counter RSPCA Victoria's false claims. . . . It wouldn't hurt if other CC members did the same. It takes just as long to write an email to your CC about the RSPCA as it does to read and post on DOL

The reason why I wont home large/giant breeds (anatolians, central asians) to owners in an apartment or very small backyard - is because I believe restricted space compromises the dog's growth and development - the lack of natural movement prevents optimal and necessary growth and stengthening of their muscular and skeletal support. For me its not so much about 'exercise' but that the dog has room to move around at its own leisure, something simple like running up a hill or incline, playing through the grass etc is very important for the joints/ligaments of a developing youngster. It is difficult / impossible to subsitute this constant yet very low impact exercise, in an apartment or courtyard environment with scheduled exercise. My canine ortho specialist says when he thinks of Anatolian and central Asian, he sees them walking very far distances at a slow amble, being on the move, in a steady non energetic way. For the most part, any structural (muscular/skeletal) issues that have arisen with the breed, have been also when the dog was raised in a 'small' environment - even if a dog had a structural fault, growing up in large allotment of land enables the dog to develop compensating muscular support - so even if a dog walks/runs with a limp, it does so up until the age of 10, 11, 12 ++ it seems to be that for anatolian and central asian, their overall health is better off when they are reared in an environment that allows them space to amble/move around at their own leisure. In an apartment / courtyard / small backyard the dogs are less inclined to move - there's no point in moving to observe only a few metres ahead; a few paces and there at the end of the boundary. imo it is not possible for a giant dog whose physical soundness relies so much on developing a fit muscular and skeletal system, to develop this fitness and muscular strength in a confined environment. nb: pending the dog's personality, mature adults can house happily with the right owner in a small area but a puppy/growing youngster is a big no no

So sorry to hear Jag - to lose puppies that late in pregnancy is very hard At what week did she receive the injection? Were prog levels monitored afterwards? Did your girl have a normal pregnancy to another sire? We're supplementing with progesterone tablets (apparently they are safer than prog injections ???) despite the possibility that a 'low prog' during pregnancy could be normal for this bitch, but given the puppies to the same import semen were lost last breeding attempt (6/7 weeks), I feel I have to go with prog supplementation this time around. While on the supplements, prog levels are being monitored every three days and an u/s once a week. I dont mind the weekly u/s, puts a worrier like me at ease to see the little bubs moving about heart beating etc all okay.

Ask someone off the street: what's a dog to be scared of, what breeds should be banned? and those that are for banning / restricting breeds, will cite rottweiler - big black and scarey - aye its gotta go, there's no place for them. If BSL is to be expanded, the rotti would be one of the favourites vying for 'next' position. The BIGGEST problem amongst dog owners / breeder / interested parties is misunderstanding of 'aggression' and the dogs involved. Most registered breeders work for their breed club, ie they are more likely to be breeding for the breed - your backyard once or twice off breeder, doesn't. How many more bull and mastiff bybs are there than registered breeders? Controlling breeding stock ... horse has already bolted on that one. There are heaps of unpapered dogs out there, it wont matter who the registered breed club breeders sell or dont sell to. And what does it mean "breeding for aggression" - can you explain what you mean by that? Do bull and mastiff registered breeders currently breed for aggression? which type of aggression? You imply that breeders can help authorites stamp out dog fighting - what do breeders know that they are not sharing, or what can they do that they are not doing? How can bull and mastiff breeders help stamp out dog fighting other than what the population at large is already doing?

yay prog is on the way back up (88) and the pups and their heartbeats are all okay (well for now)