BJean

And you have been told before that you're opinion on temperament is compromised because you do not know what constitutes a steadfast guardian dog. Yes you dont like the wording of the breed standard, but what does that matter if you dont know what the wording means? You dont understand guardian breeds and are afraid of them, I get that but to then make claims about what the standard means wrt ideal guardian temperament is a little strange. You dont like what you read of the Fila breed standard - I'm suggesting that you dont like what you read because you dont know about what you are reading, does that make sense? When I read the Fila standard, I read: intelligent, ability to discern, loyal, unwaivering, steadfast nervous system. We could argue that as an aggregate, guardian breeds of the Fila type have a more dependable and steadfast nervous system than labs - out of necessity. Can't be having any hyperactive or inane behaviour in large serious guardian breeds. You need calm thinkers, absolute predictability, unwaivering nervous system, adaptive intelligence.

Contact your breeder. Maybe they have gone through a similar process before and can offer insight/advice/treatment plan. I dont know how long cane corsos live, but I imagine from their advertising spiel that they should not be aged by the time they are 4yo.

Nope - there are other breeds that would behave with a similar ethos also. Sure, some companion bred dogs are a lot different (why wouldn't they be) - but the article doesn't make that distinction or acknowledgement.

Does that necessarily suggest a strict linear system though? Define 'strict'. Yes there are lots of was we can use word semantics / perspectives to describe why we think a dog is doing what I call dog A which uses physical force against dog B, C, D to enforce its right to mate, its right to eat, its right to drink, its right to take, its right to have precendence about what it wants the boss dominant dog. Why do dogs fight and why do some dogs always win? What makes them perservere? Why do they want what they want more than another? Same mentality as what makes a TB a rachorse or a winner. Some horses are born with the will to win. imo it is much the same thing.

For horses prone to colic, stress is a factor. You wouldn't move a colic prone horse to a different location / feed routine / pasture to monitor it for colic. Er great work by the RSPCA vet team yet again. Like the typical RSPCA storyline, it goes from the bizarre to the ridiculous to tragic

As part of the import process, I am in discussion with long time breeder (20-30 years) of Caucasian and Central Asian in Ukraine, Siberia and the way they keep their dogs and what they expect from them - imo there is no doubt that the dogs react and exist within a linear system. Some breeders of Caucasian and Central Asian in certain parts of the world will claim that the best fighters (sorry) / workers only take on the other dominant individuals and do not waste their time with those who are less worthy. (I'm not going to get into the debate of fighting/ CO CAO character testing here, so please don't bother - sorry - I figure if you have an issue with it, take it up with those who do it in Afghanistan, Turkmenistan, Kazahstan etc) but my point is there seems to be a clear system of hierachy when the dogs are left out and expected to defend for themselves. So to me, what I see in my own dogs and what other breeders see in their dogs, the concept of a non-linear system is quite bunk.

ooh just as well Nekhbet as I had you earmarked as someone for my Caucasian litter

Yeh and that worked didn't it? Random breeding is where the problem lays and when no laws prevent it, whacko, breed what you like, when you like Sure it would continue but to a far lesser extent bearing in mind, there is not quite the same profit margins in illegal dog breeding than growing dope is there???. There is no place for random breedings whatsoever which need to be stopped. Err I think drug use amongst the populace is quite endemic, though illegalisation did help to increase the profit margin. At the end of the day, if the community at large think random breedings are okay, then it is. Laws should be a reflection of society value systems. Random breedings are not the crux of the problem.

A most excellent idea, perhaps a law that prevents vets putting their prices up because they are the only health care option, or a law preventing emergency vets from charging more because they're the only place open at 2 in the morning, would also be effective?

Yeh and that worked didn't it?

DogsNSW need to gain support of their members and alleviate member concerns regarding the running of DogsNSW and the conflicts of interest plaguing the current Board. Until members see changes they wont be granting the impotent and incompetent DogsNSW board any more powers ie: x) inspection of kennels and records if requested by DOGS NSW Perhaps it would be more fitting if DogsNSW proposed an Accredited DogsNSw Board Member Scheme.

one, I am not interested to argue; that is not an exchange of ideas. second, Debate to me is informative and interesting; where both sides learn from one to the other. We cannot debate based on facts, because yours are not clear on this topic and therefore we cannot debate with reason as it is not conducive from hearsay and supposition. Thankyou.

No I think you do. Best to stick with the Labs , hey. This is getting ridiculous.

Oh no thanks I don think you need any encouragement to add more breeds to your list of massive assumptions where there is little actual knowledge or understanding. Come on. fwiw did you know the Fila was in Australia? bet you didn't know that! and shock horror wtf noone was killed! maybe they were in WA ... wil find out ... geezuz you could have been living next to a HA killer and bloody hell you survived ... :nahnah: until you are familiar with what consitutes are good guard dog and why and what that means perhaps lay off the Fila bcz you just read as all numpty and no nouse. cheers

Im surprised that a vet agreed to do it for behavioural reasons. Desexing a 13yo dog will not achieve anything but cease its ability to reproduce (if that was still functional). I guess many vets do things these days that you wonder about. On a 13yo dog, yeah that would be so.

Asserting that my dog breed(s) are better than any cross bred at their purpose bred task is not being a snob, it is stating a fact. Exactly. :D

You cant saw sawdust. Enjoy your dogs and walk on :D When I hear somone tell me that they can get a crossbred rescue dog / byb that can do the job my dogs can do, I just laugh because they dont know what they are talking about; I dont get mad kind of pity the little ignoramuses. Oooh! how norty of me ... I'm sounding like a snob :D - so what? Show me a cross bred byb rescue whatever that has the capabilty and is as sound pound for pound and then you might get my attention. But frankly, 1000 years selective breeding tempered by the elements - Vs some numpty nanosecond cross breeding idea: not likely

yep I dont think so. Those who want a dog for a certain look / temperament type will seek what can reliably be predicated to be what they are seeking - ie a pedigree pure bred. It has nothing to do with catching rats :D That selection criteria produced (& required) other traits; i think this line of thinking misses the forest for the trees somewhat. Pet homes dont seek herding breeds for their comparative advantage to herd they select them for their other traits which are a positive by-product of their breed selection criteria process. as above They are not mutually independent. There is no contradiction. Companion dogs need good nerve and that is required from all 'purpose bred' dogs. I dont know why people forget this and/or do not realise this. Yep ??? Nup.

Im surprised that a vet agreed to do it for behavioural reasons. Desexing a 13yo dog will not achieve anything but cease its ability to reproduce (if that was still functional).

Nup. Not because of content but because of the dumbing down :D

Yep that I did - "why cant you wait another month" ie: why would you go through a major operation with your dog when you dont even have a second opinion or are sure of the operation or the dog's prognosis, indeed even the first vet's opinion. "Why can't you wait another month" and pass over a time window for a procedure that is unproven and cannot be quantified? "Why can't you wait another month" because what's the worst that can happen? - Not even your vet can tell you, becasue he/she doesn't know. actually no your not. Yes only you went ahead with the operation, But I've previously dissuaded puppy buyers from getting JPS and I'll do it again - because once again I dont think an operation that noone can proove does anything but alleviate the conscientious owner's sense or "doing everything", is a valid argument for major surgery to interfere with the structure of a young growing puppy. I think both experiences are valid.

Yes that is often what happens with weak puppies; they are not strong enough to suckle properly from mouth to gut. Next time (hopefully never, touch wood ) if you have a puppy that is not gaining weight, give them ABs so they have something to fight with Their weakend system cannot fight anything on its own, hence ABs to either contend with an underlying infrection or prevent a new infection taking hold.

Did you send Jenna's hip xrays to PennHip to have an 'official' score? What is the average for Jenna's breed(s)? No we did not send off for an 'official' score. Richard did tell us at the time what the average was for Jenna's breeds but I cannot remember now. Borrowed from Zenchel: Also please read the following - it is a direct cut and paste from the PennHIP web site: Question: "My vet has advised a surgical procedure to avoid the development of arthritis in my dog later in life based on the results of his PennHIP examination. Should I have my dog operated on?" Answer: Until appropriate randomized and controlled clinical trials are designed and conducted, it is premature to use the Distraction Index as an indication for hip surgery, either remedial or preventive. At present several different surgical procedures (Triple pelvic osteotomy, Juvenile symphysiodesis) have been advocated by some veterinary surgeons to prevent the development of arthritis (degenerative joint disease) later in life in dogs with excess joint laxity (loose hips). None of these procedures have undergone scientific clinical trials that have proven THEIR EFFICACY in preventing the onset or slowing the development of arthritis in dogs with hip dysplasia. Although WE ARE not fundamentally against the use of preventative surgical management of dogs with excessive hip laxity, WE FEEL THE WHOLESALE CLINICAL USE OF PURPORTEDLY PREVENTIVE SURGICAL PROCEDURES BEFORE ADEQUATE TESTING IS CONDUCTED, IS UNJUSTIFIED. WE ADVISE CAUTION! It may be that in the future when good evidence exists to support the efficacy of these procedures their use will be encouraged"

· 70,514 dogs were received nationally by the RSPCA in the financial year 07/08 Over a five year period from 03/04 to 07/08 the number of dogs finding themselves under the RSPCAs care has increased by 4.5% meaning that in 07/08 11,920 more dogs were in this situation than in 03/04. The number of dogs reclaimed or rehomed had also increased (by 2.21%) but not as much as the number of dogs having euthanased (up by 8.91%). Its over a four year period The long term trend is different, the number of dogs has actually declined. Dog intake 97-98 was 80,776. so there has been a 12.7% REDUCTION in the number of dogs finding themselves under RSPCA care. And if we compare it to 08-09 data (intake of 69,383), there has been a 14.1% REDUCTION in the number of dogs finding themselves under RSPCA care since 1997. The significant difference between dog and cat data, is that most cats which enter the RSPCA are unowned whereas most dogs have been owned.