westiemum

Ditto. If I have a dog in the car it comes first regardless of whatever crops up. But I guess this scenario also depends on how you respond to the events. If my dog was in the car and I ran in to someone I knew I'd say I couldn't stop to talk because my dog was in the car and I needed to get back to him and would suggest giving them a call later. If there were 15 people waiting to be served I would leave my basket of goods, take my dog home and come back and get my shopping (unless of course it was the evening and there was no way the car could heat up). If I'd been gone that long and then realised I forgot something I wouldn't go back and get it without first checking on my dog and if it was something I could do without for another day I'd just leave it. There's no way I would leave my dog in the car for that long in 28 degrees, shade or not, no matter how much it inconvenienced me to leave what I was doing.

'Interfere' as much as you like! Its really refreshing to have European thoughts and perceptions on these issues... Thanks for your comment. I am not going anywhere Though because writing in English is not yet as easy as in Finnish, it keeps me not interfering to many threads. Thanks, climate is not so great, but otherwise Europe is quite nice Greece, Italy and Slovenia has very good dog culture, I think. I have been only in Italy, but there was lots of dogs in busy streets of Venice and many of them off-lead walking with their owners. Then small correction: Finland does not belong to Baltic States. Finland is just part of the Northern Europe. Dog culture in Baltic Countries (Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania) is very different compared to Finland. Those are economically really poor countries and it is also seen in their dog culture. Finns rescue lots of dogs from Estonia where abandoned dogs are living in really poor conditions (especially winter is horrible for dogs, since they live mostly outdoor) but they refuse to euthanize animals.

Oh and Elina I forgot to say how good it is to have you on DOL. I don't think we have many Scandinavian members. Hope you stick around and we hear much more from you and see more of your gorgeous dogs! :D

moosmum: moosmum this is so true. And works in the workplace too. I work in human resources (for the moment!) and in this field and in dog behaviour as well 'you can't teach "not"!. The HR field is changing from the 'policy police' (don't do this, don't do that) to much smarter ways of encouraging people to behave reasonably in the workplace, thorough principles, codes of conduct, workplace expectation etc. And I don't believe dog behaviour in public and in local communities is any different. We train our dogs using positive reinforcers (teach them what we want, not what we don't want, which is what legislation does) and this needs to be extended to community ground rules and expectations. And community 'enforcement' (for want of a better word) will always be more successful than legislative enforcement. Australia is the most over governed country on the face of the planet IMO - and sadly dog legislation is not different.

Yes!!!! :D :laugh:

Steve: Yep precisely. This is what I do even in suburbia - houses or townhouse complexes makes no difference. All my animalsover the years have been personally introduced to the neighbours. They know them by name and occasionally look after them for me when I'm away - and they all get a turn! One of my neighbours is very fond of my westie girl Sarah and talks to her across the fence! (I suggested a doggie door in the fence but her hubby felt that was getting a bit tooo cosy!) They are part of this community and I have an agreement with the community that if they are ever any problem to please let me know and I'll do something about it. And I've never had one complaint over the years and years I've had aninals - not one. And at the moment I have 4 animals here in inner suburban Adelaide - a divine moggie and the three westies. So like other posters, I think many of the restrictions we have around dogs in Australia actually causes the problems. So its time for significant attitude change and enlightenment European style...

Yesterday it was 33 degrees here - I went to check on a friends house who is OS at the moment and took Mac with me for a walk around the house. I then needed to duck into the local supermarket for 5 items. I took Mac home and then went back to the supermarket. If it was the middle of winter and 10 degrees I probably would have ducked in with him in the car. But in yesterdays heat? No way - never an option!

I was inside Vienna International Airport in early October last year, waiting in the BA queue as usual - and in walks a westie walking his owner!! Having been westie starved for 3 weeks I lost my spot in the queue to get a westie cuddle! His poor owner I'm sure wondered if all Australians were this strange! But I do remember thinking how enlightened! Dogs are integrated into European life and (I assume) as long as they are well behaved they are welcome in many public places. They assume an importance in everyday life that we here in Australia can only dream about! Even in England, my friends new Schnauzer puppy was allowed to sit on our laps at dinner at the local pub! (He was 'booked in' as well!) The problem here seems to be that they are generally excluded from most public life instead of included through some sort of long-standing Victorian attitude. Can you imagine dogs being allowed to greet home-coming owners in airports in Australia? They'd probably have to go through the security xray conveyor thingos with the laptops - or take their collars and leads off and have their own security queue!

Sheridan they look fabulous - and what a credit they are to you. ;) :rolleyes: Happy birthday Grumpy from westiemum and Mac the grumpy westie! (Who in honour of your birthday is having a very good day! ;))

Thanks very much corvus - will do - thats good to know. :rolleyes:

;) ;) Sheridan I haven't laughed so much in days! Thanks so much - and you just might be right! :rolleyes:

Post ictally, my little boy usually sleeps and is a bit quiet the next day. I remember how worried and shocked I was when I first saw his focal seizure, even though it was fairly mild. He doesn't lose consciousness, shake all over, nor is he incontinent. Now, although it still worries me I simply hold him and cuddle him until the seizure stops and he goes to sleep. Sometimes some dogs will have a seizure and never have another - I hope thats the case with your little girl. Good luck.

Yes in the last week to ten days it's hit home that my beloved Mac, who I've had for 5 years in March is really getting old and my days with him are numbered. I do know that I have given him a wonderful life (and he me), but the reality is hard... so I treasure every moment with him. Happy Birthday Maxi and here's to many more happy and healthy ones.

Yep great minds think alike Erny - I was thinking along exactly the same lines - that I would try some of the special foods and discuss the Aktivait possibility with the vet on Monday and go from there. Whatever it is, he is mild at the moment and the behaviour is very manageable. I'm really really hoping that I've caught it early and can at least give him a good quality of life for as long as possible - assuming this is what I'm dealing with. Thanks everyone - I really appreciate your support, kind words and advice. :D I have no experience with Dementia or the diets and drugs available to assist it, so I'm afraid the only advice I can offer is to be guided by a Vet who is experienced in it. If it were me, I guess I'd like to explore a diet only adjustment to see how that would go. But if the dementia is further on and/or if the behaviour is too problematic then the diet may not be efficient enough or sufficiently effective. I don't what the side effects of the drugs are, so I think that needs to be explored with the help of your Vet as well. I just don't know enough about it for me to be of any help to you Westiemum, but I do hope you find your way with some good expert guidance .

Koemi I'm so sorry to hear about your girl - how old was she? By 'breeding machine' do you mean she was an ex-breeding dog from a puppy farm? (Hope you don't mind me asking). Thanks Koemi, Erny and Bonny Beagle - you're gems. Have spent the evening getting informed: And so far it seems to me there are a couple of ways to approach this - drugs, nutritional supplementation or both. What do you think? Drugs: Vivitonin and Anypril (l-deprenyl) which is also used in Cushings as well as canine senility Nutritional supplementation: Hill B/D and a new promising supplement called Aktivait - but for the life of me I can't find an Australian distributor anywhere - all sellers seem to be out of the UK? Has anyone used Aktivait? Where did you get it and how did you find it? (I've read it can take a couple of weeks to kick in). The old boy growled later at the young boy westie - as if he didn't recognise him. Since then he has been sleeping peacefully since the barking episode earlier this evening on a beautiful quilt I bought from a DOLer whose name I've forgotten - thanks to whoever you are!. I've noticed that if he sleeps with me he seems to sleep through the night without any middle of the night wandering! - well thats my story and I'm sticking to it! Thanks again.

Thanks everyone - yes it is the Hills B/D - I've just done a search so will see if I can pick some up tomorrow. Although I'm not a big fan of dry food I think its worth a try. Bonny beagle did you find that the DAP actually worked? I talked to one of the vet nurses some time ago who suggested it for my other westie who was night guarding and waking up the whole household. Do you think its worth the expense? Erny what do you mean by diet? Can you point me in the right direction? Sheridan I'll talk to the vet on Monday about the vivitonin. Thanks very much everyone - he's lying next to me at the moment, growling with increasing volume and occasional barks. He then stops puts his head down on his paws then starts again... very strange and rather distressing to watch... he's really barking now... very unusual for him to bark like this... particularly inside....

Thanks Sheridan - my Mac is sounding like an earlier stage of your Grumpy. I've booked him into the vet on Monday night - so we'll see what she thinks. The funny thing is he seems better today and hasn't let me out of his sight all night - which is usual. Thansk again for your reply - much appreciated.

I don't expect my vet to fund my animals through credit - I pay as I go (with one exception last year) - and I'm incredibly grateful for their help. GPs don't do credit, very few bulk bill anymore and you pay up front so I don't see why vets should be any different. I agree there is a need for people taking animals on to be better informed about vet costs and plan accordingly. I'm not putting tickets on myself - but I pay extra into my mortgage to fund the uninsured animals and insure the other two. I admit 4 animals is the limit of what I can afford and there won't be others after the first one goes over the bridge. Staranais I visited the Esther Honey Foundation in the Cook Islands back in 2008 - and while I support the fabulous work they do they sure do it all on a shoestring - and I'm not sure how it would work in Australia - there would certainly be two tiers of care - and I'm not sure thats a good idea. I think Lort Smith works solely on donations - and if I remember correctly from my time in Melbourne the vet care was excellent but basic. I'm not sure what the solution is - except to say its not the vets responsibility and until there is a Medicare for animals (in my dreams! ) that people need to plan for vet expenses through savings, insurance or a combination of both - or don't have pets - harsh as that sounds. If you can't afford the vet bills you can't afford the pet.

Thanks everyone for your replies - much appreciated. Persephone has sight appears quite good - he finds his way around without bumping into things and has no difficulty finding dropped pieces of food in the kitchen - he's still my little westie hoover - although I know he could be smelling it. There's certainly nothing wrong with that. He's still the most gorgeous boy who still adores tummy rubs - its just that he doesn't seem to be as 'with it' as he was.... Or am I just being a paranoid 'mother'? :D

Most of you are familiar with my beloved Mac - my ex puppy farm rescue westie who is now 11.5 years... a little background... in the last 12-15 months he has had 2 ACL repairs and a full left ear ablation and yet appears physically to be in the best shape he's been in for years and pain free - couldn't believe how he bounded up and down the stairs at the beach weekend before last when before his ACL ops he would wait and look plaintively until someone carried him and down. He's very deaf (years of chronic untreated ear infections in the puppy farm) and has aging thickening cloudy lenses in his eyes although he still appears to see quite well. He has some arthritis and isn't as fast on his legs as he was but he still runs around (more slowly) and gets around with the other two westies. He still greets me at the door as usual with the other westies. No toileting problems. Generally sleeps through the night - occasionally wakes up and goes outside for a wee (doggie door). The only meds he is on are sylvet capsules for his arthritis and joint powder. Anyway I'm booking him into my vet tomorrow... but in the meantime could I have some opinions please... Over the last few months since I returned from overseas in mid October, I've noticed he appears to be becoming a grumpy westie. A couple of weeks ago he barked at me inside - he's never done that before although it was dinner time and he does let me know - that's not unusual - its the barking that was unusual. Last night I was sitting in the lounge with the other two westies and suddenly heard this growling - it was coming from my bedroom. I went in, Mac was lying on his rug on the floor and seemed to be growling at nothing - he stopped when he realised I was there. Tonight, he was on the lounge next to me and seemed to start growling at nothing. He's done this before over the last few months but I thought it was directed at the youngest boy westie - and often a minor vocal 'dispute' over who's sleeping in what dog bed. Never any snapping or biting. Occasionally when he looks at me, he seems to stare at me and be a bit confused/fearful?. Yes I know I'm probably answering my own question and I'm fairly sure its the beginning of some form of doggie dementia (TBC) - but please can I have some opinions on that and some practical advice, aside from the vet involvement, in the meantime? How quickly can I expect this to progress if that's what it is? Thanks everyone.

Well said YG. I think that's the way forward too. We can all just be a little more aware too The westies and I would love to catch up with everyone on the 6th and I'm really looking forward to it.

pewithers: Yes I do too and I think thats very good advice. I'm also very proactive with my neighbours. I make a point of introducing my animals to all my neighbours so, they know them by name as individuals, not just anonymous nuisance pests. I also invite the neighbours to a BBQ where they get to know them and ask them to feed them for me once, maybe twice a year. And so they become sort of 'community dogs'. And the neighbours know absolutely to come and talk to me if any of them are a pest at any time (its nveer happened once in living in 5 states). After my cat went AWOL a while back, half the neighbourhood was looking out for him for me. (Yes he came home when he was hungry!) So knowing the ranger would be a good idea as well. Although I know its a bit late for you charliehotel, so I'd cop it sweet this time and use it as an opportunity to get to know your ranger and your neighbours who might help you out if the dog gets out again.

Hi All, Have just caught up with this thread - and although I haven't been for a while (I always remember the day after! ) as the original suggester of the Main Street Eastwood park for Willow's birthday a couple of years back, I think we've forgotten what these 'meet and greets' were supposed to be all about. I heard about the 'disturbance' (for want of a better word) at the last meet from friends who live on Main Street and were concerned about a public park being taken over by uncontrolled dogs. Now how true that was I don't know as I wasn't there. But that was their perception. But I do think there are a few things to remember: The park is a small public park in a narrow residential street and the council is Burnside (say no more! ). Its an off leash park as long as we use it properly and remember other people who might like to use it as well. We don't have sole rights to its use and it will only take a complaint or two to council for its status to change and we'll have to go elsewhere. I'd hate that to happen as I use the park for other social activities with my dogs other than DOL meets (although I know its is not about me). I personally think it is ideal for our needs with BBQ, tables, toilet, children's playground, shade and a tap and would like to see it stay that way. Apart from Willows birthday, important as that was, the meets were designed for DOLers to meet offline safely in a public park, to expose many of our rescue dogs (and new puppies!) to another socialisation opportunity with people who understood and could tolerate rescue dogs (and puppies) who were learning new behaviours , to have some drinks and nibbles and maybe a few snags, (not a full blown lunch party), and to chat and hopefully make some new like-minded friends. Dogs were leashed unless they were under control - similar to the beach. If they are not under control then they need to be on a leash - for their sake and for everyone elses. I don't believe the park is big enough for balls and agility and frizbees and the like and we must not exclude other people from using the park by our presence. In fact we should be modelling, courteous, responsible and exemplary dog ownership and showcase our rescue dogs to other park users - not frighten them off. I can't remember who it was but someone (who worked at Inghams?) used to bring some of the freshest chicken necks I've ever seen and use them to 'train' some dogs and pups to sit if owners were happy - and they were the only treats and once they were gone they were gone. And it was wonderful modelling for other park users and we had some compliments from passers by on our 'lovely dogs' (genuine question: would that have happened at the last meet?). There were no other treats (apart form the occasional snag in the dirt! My Mac was the fastest gun in the west at finding dropped snags! He's starving of course! ) I would suggest that we revert to the original guidelines and leash our dogs who do not have reliable recall or good control (but they are still welcome otherwise how do they learn?), people leash dogs who are off leash and get out of control without being offended if someone suggests it with everyones interests at heart, stick to a drink and some nibbles, no dog treats or balls or similar, and all agree to keep our dogs under control (note I did not say 'leashed'). :D Everyone is welcome. And consider others in the area who might like to use the park too. Thoughts? Hope to see you on 6 Feb.

One ex-breeding bitch here - she was desexed at 5 and a half immediately after I got her - and haven't had a problem. Interesting thread.

Gayle I'm so sorry to hear the time has come for you and your old girl - but what a marvellous innings you have had together. The westies and I will be thinking of you tomorrow.