Steve K9Pro

K9: Its just "good practice" for the lower pack member to eat last, but its not essential.

K9: I could give you a text book answer but it wont help, the dogs would need to be observed & other things taken into account to give you an accurate idea.

K9: It isnt so much as them trying to dominate her, as they are correcting her, & when they do that in your presence they arent recognising you as the Alpha, so in fact they are being rank or dominant around you. Who was there first isnt a deciding factor for the dogs. It can be complicated when looking at a dog pack, too hard to say here, but I would be starting groundwork programs like my Triangle of Temptation program & NILIF programs if you havent already, these can't hurt any situation unless you have rank dogs & you apply to much direct pressure, this can get you bitten. I would also be excercising pack control through obedience & boundaries. E collars are not the only tool to sort this out, it can be done many ways, e collar is just one way (& probably the best). Best get your dogs looked at & see where they are in terms of leadership & pack structure.

K9: you have a pack structure issue there, I would (although I havent seen your dogs) be re adjusting bthe pack with more Alpha status from you, this can be done by using more obedience backed up with the e collar, but there will be other things required.

K9: your very welcome, the DT isnt a crap collar, by any stretch, I have just used a lot of e collars, tested probably every mainstream collar including Tri Tronics & have found the Dogtras the best we can recommend K9: yes, the 1902 Dogtra has both dogs available to stim, no switches to make. But your goal wouldnt be to stim both at once... Although you could. The goal of my training style is to use the lowest level of stim possible so the dog can remain clear headed & not frightened of the stim, stimming two dogs at once means they might be driven more than normal in say rank drive which will mean higher levels of stim. K9: ok the wait is over lol..

K9: I too think the idea is good, however when you try this on lots of dogs, you will find a large majority will not react favourably. Maybe do a search on here & see what comes up? Its not impossible to pair the vibration with something positive, I personally have just found that pairing something that starts as a severe negative (to the dog) takes some time to convert to positive, sometimes not possible at all. I have preferred in the past to use alternatives that dont start negative. I have never thought it neccessary to use the vibration feature to deliver my positives. K9: I dont think the length of time in production is a top of the list priority in choosing electronics, maybe thats just me. K9: Sorry if I wasnt clear, I have looked into it, tested a few collars, & decided that they werent what we would recommend. I prefer Dogtra over anything else in remote trainers. Containment systems Innotek, no bark collars vary between a few dependant on a few variables. Some considerations that took place in this situation that did fall on top of my list were: - Reliability Durability Build quality Consistency of levels (often levelled collars different outputs on different days) Usefulness of features. We test the hell out of anything we recommend.

K9: what have you compared them too? K9: Actually in many of the tests I have done, the large majority of dogs find the vibration frightening, how many dogs have you tried this on? We can get this brand, its something we have chosen not to though...

K9: great work!

K9: Your a legend! Very well done.... (Seita has learned this work by email, she has done very very well)

K9: yeah it can be a tricky one, some believe that the dog will never reach its genetic potential if it has had negative reactions to drive... K9: try a few different methods, like restricting all other activities to zero for a while, reducing the dogs options for drive satisfaction to your toy & your toy alone, no walks, no other training & very little interaction can have a big improvement..

K9: look I know its only terminology but when I erad it like you have written, it is drive limiting just to think that way... What should control the dogs drive is the dog, not your permission, I allow the dog to do as many dumb things as it likes until the dog decides that the best way to achieve drive satisfaction is my way, not me issuing or revoking permission.. K9: wrong, she would its about prey drive not rank drive. Once the alpha allows prey drive to exist, it becomes part of the alphas desired behaviours.. K9: maybe? or looking for a way to reduce your alpha status with this game perhaps? I dont know as I cant see her... But, even if it is working, what I was on about was, your starting to get results, but results with flaws built in if you get my drift? K: I haven't worked her according to a Program. I was thinking that I may be reaching a point where I could work her within a program and what I read of yours seemed ideal. K9: this work can be a little tricky without all the steps, it will always look like results are coming but good results are another thing. As I mentioned, my total program isnt anywhere you could read it as such, we do run distance learning programs but they are designed individually. K9: sorry I wasnt aware of where you were, & no I just havent had the time to put together a video... The problem I guess I have with videos are that they often only show how it goes when things run to plan, not what probably will happen in your home... K9: Any style of training where adrenalin flows is technically training in drive, even stressing a dog in avoidance is training in drive, there are training methods that teach the dog to act in a way that achieves drive satisfaction through the handler & there are programs that use a drive reward, to me & to your dog, they can all vary greatly...

K9: I am not sure that you have a good grasp of what needs to be done in drive training, my actual program (its not on DOL anywhere) has steps designed in to avoid the pitfalls such as possessiveness, chasing other prey, owning the triggers etc. If your anywhere near us or a seminar, I suggest you come along & see a better outline of what I do, it can get a bit confusing.. K9: this may not be pure prey drive though, it seems she may be driven by a pack advantage? K9: Your dog should not be able to initiate the game...

K9: The tie out isnt a neccessity, would rather people learn concepts from me rather than actual steps.. When we have dogs that have massive amounts of drive, the tie out is the saviour for your hands & it takes the advantahe of speed off the dog. So if you can only trigger drive without the tie out, so be it. However, I have found that many people avoid the tie out & get to drive training, only to find out that the commands they have taught are non triggerable when the dog is leashed, as the leashes is a que to cool it.. So I would start this dog with a collar, then add 1 foot of rope & make sure I had the same drive, gradually extend the rope longer until its a leash I can at least hang onto in the work. K9: the two wont connect in the dogs head until later drive training, when the communications words will become helpful, so I would start right now... In a way, the TOT is also about removing options for the dog, by the dog. It also improves the value of the tie out in step one... Tie out = being fed... K9: there is a section in my program that deals with the dog needing to see a triggr very early n in training, which stops this problem occuring. K9: see, you did have a trigger command... K9: nope, this is something they are taught, pairing takes place when repetition of a step occurs.. K9: remember rule number one when it comes to rewards, "the reward must be something rewarding to the DOG".. I prefer prey dogs too, but I will use food on food driven dogs..

K9: yeah terrible isnt it? Going from beating hell out of each other to off leash obedience in a matter of weeks.. Dont know how you can live with only those results... Well done CB

K9: These guys are looking for accomodation in Victoria, not near me RL..

[email protected]

K9: Done...

K9: give it time... K9: these may be related, need more info, probbaly best if you see my friend up there, Jane Harper to help with these issues... K9: I hear you, its not on...

K9: your dog knows this, it will be a habit that will need to be broken. K9: thats what I call making a deal with the devil... I would be cautious with that route... He will be looking to aquire more real estate soon enough...

K9: In that case I will send it to you anyway... Have you sent in the request for one ticket? if you have just email me direct & I will send you the prog.. Did you read in the email one person buying a 3 day event ticket will be winning a private consult? This will be drawn when all 3 day event tickets are sold out, which by the look of bokings wont be long.

K9: re payment system, just may take a little while, the Vic tour will be taking up a lot of our time... Any one interested can contact us on [email protected]

K9: might be a great dog for a demo... If you do bring him along, come see me when you arrive & I will remember you when doggy time comes up... K9: cool, Judi nor I will have an environment that will over stress him.. If you want to crate train him, & your purchasing a 3 day event ticket, I will send yo my crate training program free...

K9: yep along with 600 other emails lol... I just replied

K9: Why we named it the "take the guesswork out tour" is that we want to be able to teach the "concepts" that cover just about any temperament dog....

That's why I want to bring Kiz - she's absolutly MAD and has a really high drive - balls, tugs, me moving, chicken, cheese (anythings good in her books), she use to be an absolute skitz in agility but have learnt how to use that hyper to my advantage, been a long process and learning curve. Still haven't worked out how to do it with obedience. I think my brain has gone on strike Looking forward to it (but not the 3 hr trip down though). K9: well I will be travelling further! lol, Cant wait to see your dog! PLACES ARE FILLING FAST